Great post! I would just add that the same principle applies anytime you get the disc in your hands with your defender not near you, which also happens frequently on turnovers. For example, almost any time you intercept a pass, you should get the disc and yourself moving immediately. And similarly when the other team throws incomplete into the end-zone, often the player who expects to setup a mark just waits at the front of the end zone for you to arrive with the disc and you can, instead, throw-and-go immediately from where the disc landed.
Agreed. I can make a post to highlight that you don't always need to walk the disc up after an endzone turnover, but I have to find some good examples first. There was an example you and I discussed in a separate conversation, but I don't think that particular one would be convincing to the non-believers. But it happens often enough that I should be able to find a few clips before too long...
Great stuff. I think in the first example the move is stunted by the outwards turn after catching - if they had stayed facing the thrower or turned inwards, they could have done a give-go themselves and continued to advance up the field (double dribble style).
Example 3 with Freechild is also a great opportunity for a double dribble, but the catcher isn't aware that his defender has poached far off (leaving loads of space in front of them).
Example two with Travis I wonder if a 1m lefty backhand look initially would have either worked or would have drawn the defender further over, opening up the no-pivot righty outside in backhand downfield.
When the catcher gets up and just stands there, maybe fakes a big huck or something, I get incensed! Can remember talking about what to do in this situation on livestreams and videos - can't remember exactly which now either, but I've asked in the discord so should find out soon.
Coincidentally, three training idea I was thinking of when your article arrived in my email involved the thrower and force starting by lying on the floor, having to get up, establish a connection with a nearby teammate in a 1v1, and complete a pass within 3s. Now added bonus points for a completed give-go & a double dribble!
Re: first example (Brute Squad). I don't think I'm as convinced as you are that we should *always* turn in, but I'd agree in this case. The thrower probably should've seen that Hoffmann was coming up for the give-and-go, and turned towards her.
Re: second example (Travis Dunn). I agree, I was a little surprised the thrower didn't look for a little loopy OI backhand. It seemed like a relatively windless day from what I've seen. But we can never really know what happened, we all have those moments where we just randomly can't manage to get the disc into the right grip at the right moment.
Thanks for finding the link. I really thought it was mentioned offhand in the middle of another video, not something you'd made a video focused on. I always try not to make the same content that other people have already made! Before I wrote this article, I watched like 6 of your videos trying to find where it was mentioned and couldn't find it. (I'm not a fan of the "shorts" format, so I suppose it's not surprising I missed it.)
Anyways, I suppose it's still good that I've raised a tiny bit more awareness, and added a couple more examples to our collective database of clips. I'm editing the article to put in the link to your video.
Great post! I would just add that the same principle applies anytime you get the disc in your hands with your defender not near you, which also happens frequently on turnovers. For example, almost any time you intercept a pass, you should get the disc and yourself moving immediately. And similarly when the other team throws incomplete into the end-zone, often the player who expects to setup a mark just waits at the front of the end zone for you to arrive with the disc and you can, instead, throw-and-go immediately from where the disc landed.
Agreed. I can make a post to highlight that you don't always need to walk the disc up after an endzone turnover, but I have to find some good examples first. There was an example you and I discussed in a separate conversation, but I don't think that particular one would be convincing to the non-believers. But it happens often enough that I should be able to find a few clips before too long...
Great stuff. I think in the first example the move is stunted by the outwards turn after catching - if they had stayed facing the thrower or turned inwards, they could have done a give-go themselves and continued to advance up the field (double dribble style).
Example 3 with Freechild is also a great opportunity for a double dribble, but the catcher isn't aware that his defender has poached far off (leaving loads of space in front of them).
Example two with Travis I wonder if a 1m lefty backhand look initially would have either worked or would have drawn the defender further over, opening up the no-pivot righty outside in backhand downfield.
When the catcher gets up and just stands there, maybe fakes a big huck or something, I get incensed! Can remember talking about what to do in this situation on livestreams and videos - can't remember exactly which now either, but I've asked in the discord so should find out soon.
Coincidentally, three training idea I was thinking of when your article arrived in my email involved the thrower and force starting by lying on the floor, having to get up, establish a connection with a nearby teammate in a 1v1, and complete a pass within 3s. Now added bonus points for a completed give-go & a double dribble!
Re: first example (Brute Squad). I don't think I'm as convinced as you are that we should *always* turn in, but I'd agree in this case. The thrower probably should've seen that Hoffmann was coming up for the give-and-go, and turned towards her.
Re: second example (Travis Dunn). I agree, I was a little surprised the thrower didn't look for a little loopy OI backhand. It seemed like a relatively windless day from what I've seen. But we can never really know what happened, we all have those moments where we just randomly can't manage to get the disc into the right grip at the right moment.
Thanks for finding the link. I really thought it was mentioned offhand in the middle of another video, not something you'd made a video focused on. I always try not to make the same content that other people have already made! Before I wrote this article, I watched like 6 of your videos trying to find where it was mentioned and couldn't find it. (I'm not a fan of the "shorts" format, so I suppose it's not surprising I missed it.)
Anyways, I suppose it's still good that I've raised a tiny bit more awareness, and added a couple more examples to our collective database of clips. I'm editing the article to put in the link to your video.
Here we go:
Hive Ultimate
What to do after your defender lays out past you #shorts
https://youtube.com/shorts/u9VY7baLGas?si=jDTG6FiParTHhbkT